What is the point of time estimates?
binks says:
The only useful workflow I can think of for "time estimates" is something like...
I have an essay to write. It will take 7 days, and is due on Friday the 7th. When I look at RTM (in my "weekly Planner" or "overview") or at my calender through ical syncing; I should see on Friday the 1st "Write Essay, Due Friday the 7th".
... but that doesn't seem to be how it works. If I've got a task that will take a month, it won't look any different then a task that I estimate will take 10 minutes - "Write final paper" and "bush teeth" are both due on the 7th, and there's just no way to visualize the size and level of prep needed for a given task.
It looks like you can't even have RTM notify you when you've entered your "time estimate" period (you can only be notified based on due dates, not on "when you should start").
The only information I've found on this was from this thread, way back in July of 2008: http://www.rememberthemilk.com/forums/help/5058/
Where the answer was "no, you can't do that".
I've only started using this product recently, but that limitation has taken me from "let's purchase it so I can get this going" to looking for other solutions.
However, I'm new at this and it has been 7 months since that thread was posted - have things changed? Am I missing an obvious checkbox?
Thanks
I have an essay to write. It will take 7 days, and is due on Friday the 7th. When I look at RTM (in my "weekly Planner" or "overview") or at my calender through ical syncing; I should see on Friday the 1st "Write Essay, Due Friday the 7th".
... but that doesn't seem to be how it works. If I've got a task that will take a month, it won't look any different then a task that I estimate will take 10 minutes - "Write final paper" and "bush teeth" are both due on the 7th, and there's just no way to visualize the size and level of prep needed for a given task.
It looks like you can't even have RTM notify you when you've entered your "time estimate" period (you can only be notified based on due dates, not on "when you should start").
The only information I've found on this was from this thread, way back in July of 2008: http://www.rememberthemilk.com/forums/help/5058/
Where the answer was "no, you can't do that".
I've only started using this product recently, but that limitation has taken me from "let's purchase it so I can get this going" to looking for other solutions.
However, I'm new at this and it has been 7 months since that thread was posted - have things changed? Am I missing an obvious checkbox?
Thanks
binks says:
So far as I can tell the only thing to do would be to set the DUE DATE as the point at which I think I need to start working on it - at least that way it could sit in "overdue" until it is ACTUALLY due; and I could get some notifications.
Of course, this is not perfect ("Is this due date a fake due date to give me time to complete this before the real due date, or a real due date?") and it still doesn't use the "time estimates"... so I guess my original question remains.
Maybe RTM simply isn't built with "medium-to-large" projects in mind (maybe it's only intended for quick things like, "remember the milk"; and not larger, longer to complete tasks which require multi-day preparation)?
If that is the case, can anyone suggest an alternate product that is more robust? Certainly a great manager for small tasks has its place, but I'm a student - large papers and assignments are what I need to organize most urgently, and a reminder email 3 hours before the due date isn't really effective.
Of course, this is not perfect ("Is this due date a fake due date to give me time to complete this before the real due date, or a real due date?") and it still doesn't use the "time estimates"... so I guess my original question remains.
Maybe RTM simply isn't built with "medium-to-large" projects in mind (maybe it's only intended for quick things like, "remember the milk"; and not larger, longer to complete tasks which require multi-day preparation)?
If that is the case, can anyone suggest an alternate product that is more robust? Certainly a great manager for small tasks has its place, but I'm a student - large papers and assignments are what I need to organize most urgently, and a reminder email 3 hours before the due date isn't really effective.
(closed account) says:
hey, fellow student here.
This is how I make it work: ignore time estimates. Seriously. They aren't really useful. Put when essays are due in the due date.
What you are now missing is "advance notice" i.e. knowing "Oh I should start writing this now!". I do that with Smartlists. I could jump on a loooong explanation, but I'll rather cite my sources:
What are smartlists?
http://www.rememberthemilk.com/help/answers/smartlists/whatare.rtm
What kinds of searches can you do?
http://www.rememberthemilk.com/help/answers/search/advanced.rtm
Example (personal, you can use it/adapt it if you like)
(tag:@work OR tag:@all OR tag:@city OR tag:@internet OR tag:@call) AND ((dueWithin:"25 days of today" AND priority:1) OR (dueWithin:"20 days of today" AND priority:2) OR (dueWithin:"12 days of today" AND priority:3) OR (dueWithin:"1 week of today") OR (dueBefore:today))
Enjoy (it's only after you get this working that RTM "clicks")
This is how I make it work: ignore time estimates. Seriously. They aren't really useful. Put when essays are due in the due date.
What you are now missing is "advance notice" i.e. knowing "Oh I should start writing this now!". I do that with Smartlists. I could jump on a loooong explanation, but I'll rather cite my sources:
What are smartlists?
http://www.rememberthemilk.com/help/answers/smartlists/whatare.rtm
What kinds of searches can you do?
http://www.rememberthemilk.com/help/answers/search/advanced.rtm
Example (personal, you can use it/adapt it if you like)
(tag:@work OR tag:@all OR tag:@city OR tag:@internet OR tag:@call) AND ((dueWithin:"25 days of today" AND priority:1) OR (dueWithin:"20 days of today" AND priority:2) OR (dueWithin:"12 days of today" AND priority:3) OR (dueWithin:"1 week of today") OR (dueBefore:today))
Enjoy (it's only after you get this working that RTM "clicks")
(closed account) says:
by the way, I really think that this kind of workflow should be highlighted or otherwise recommended to new users by the RTM team...
They miss on the good bits!
They miss on the good bits!
binks says:
Aaah; that helps things make more sense. Looks like you're using priority to figure out the "notify time" required.
Too bad Smart Lists don't really seem to travel well outside of RTM (don't appear with ical, can't see it in the Gmail add-in or the iGoogle page, and don't syncronize with Milksync to the Blackberry).
Thanks for the advice!
Too bad Smart Lists don't really seem to travel well outside of RTM (don't appear with ical, can't see it in the Gmail add-in or the iGoogle page, and don't syncronize with Milksync to the Blackberry).
Thanks for the advice!
(closed account) says:
yep, I use priority (but you might use tags or even time estimate!)
Smartlists DO appear in ical (subscribe to the smartlist feed instead of the regular list feed! then you can filter through the smartlists in your calendar of choice)
Tags appear in the gmail gadget. Not smartlists, but hey, you can mentally adjust after a while.
No luck on igoogle or Blackberrys as far as I know though...
(they do work with the FARR addon, look in services, its very powerful!)
Smartlists DO appear in ical (subscribe to the smartlist feed instead of the regular list feed! then you can filter through the smartlists in your calendar of choice)
Tags appear in the gmail gadget. Not smartlists, but hey, you can mentally adjust after a while.
No luck on igoogle or Blackberrys as far as I know though...
(they do work with the FARR addon, look in services, its very powerful!)
gui.azurdia says:
A suggestion:
1. Don't complicate your life
2. Do this. Create a task that reads "Report should be started 2/12/09
3. Then create another task dated 2/12/09 that reads "Write report"
4. Then create a task that reads "Turn in report" on the secific date
Very important: Every task will be tagged "Report"
Thenwhole process takes less than 3 minutes on the iphone. Even less on desktop.
Questions?
1. Don't complicate your life
2. Do this. Create a task that reads "Report should be started 2/12/09
3. Then create another task dated 2/12/09 that reads "Write report"
4. Then create a task that reads "Turn in report" on the secific date
Very important: Every task will be tagged "Report"
Thenwhole process takes less than 3 minutes on the iphone. Even less on desktop.
Questions?
(closed account) says:
hm. different workflow, but I like it. I think I wouldnt like having so many tags around, but seems very nice.
binks says:
@vjcamarena:
Thanks for prompting me to look at smartlists; I think that's where most of the power of RTM is located
@gui.azurdia
I appreciate the simplicity of this system; and it looks like it would travel pretty well. Additionally, reminder messages should fire perfectly this way. I think that this going to be my preferred workflow for its simplicity.
Thanks a lot to the both of you!
Thanks for prompting me to look at smartlists; I think that's where most of the power of RTM is located
@gui.azurdia
I appreciate the simplicity of this system; and it looks like it would travel pretty well. Additionally, reminder messages should fire perfectly this way. I think that this going to be my preferred workflow for its simplicity.
Thanks a lot to the both of you!